Through the Lens: Jordan Jenkins' Journey to Life Camera Soul

Join Al Marschke from Saga Media as he sits down with the up-and-coming visionary behind Life Camera Soul Photography, Jordan Jenkins. In this inspiring episode of "Through the Lens," we dive into Jordan's photographic odyssey, exploring the pivotal moments that led him to chase the light and capture life through his unique perspective.

From his earliest clicks to the latest snapshots, Jordan shares his candid story of stepping out of his comfort zone and the transformative power of following one’s passion. Al, a seasoned professional in the field, and Jordan, a rising star, exchange insights on the art and soul of photography, the challenges and triumphs of starting a business, and the future aspirations that keep their shutters clicking.

Whether you’re a fellow photographer, an entrepreneur at heart, or someone looking to kindle your creative spark, this conversation promises to illuminate the path of turning a passion into a profession. Tune in to "Through the Lens" and be part of a dialogue about growing, learning, and envisioning the future of photography.

Transcript

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So welcome to another episode of Untold Stories. Or I kind of dig into the background of interesting people. And sometimes those interesting people are entrepreneurs that I meet through networking. I grow my business through networking, I meet other people growing their business through networking. And today I've got a professional portrait photographer with me. Now I'm a photographer. We can probably dig into the technical stuff on photography, but I don't think that's what we're really here for. This is about uncovered story, so today I'm here with Jordan Jenkins, who is a portrait photographer here in Pittsburgh. We met at the Chamber Connections meetings. We we regularly attend those meetings. And you started attending those because obviously you wanted to grow your business in portrait photography. But tell me about your background frame your business for me and tell me how you got through the chamber to promote your business. Yeah, so I'll start with how I got into photography. You first of all. So this was 2017, my sophomore year of college, going into my junior year of college. So my girlfriend at the time, she always wanted me to like, take photos of her for, like social media and things of that sort. And this time, like, I gonna get real specific. This time we were in Oakland getting some Rita's and she wanted me to take some photos of her. And at this time I'm like, I'm getting so again, all the angles and whatnot, you know, just making sort of images are some pretty great images. And in a misdemeanor, the one that came to mind was like, I could get paid from doing this. So fast forward to what's my fourth semester of my junior year has started. I use my tuition reimbursement to purchase my first camera off of Amazon, and since then I just been honing in on my craft and I still use that same camera to this day. you want to grow your business, right? So you're you're networking. You started a business in photography and you want to grow it. So what are you doing to grow it? How how is that work? And so we got into the chambers how we met. So that step to say, okay, I took the step of starting a business. I got to be customers, right? That's the next thing and get the word out. Yeah. So I'll say it first started off with before I even got into like networking through like chambers or things of that sort. It pretty much started off through like social media. So social media plays a major aspect in me running my business and things of that sort. So I started off finding class through social media and it pretty much was just going off of word of mouth to those clients as well as me just posting my work from those past sessions and just like in those sessions, build on to the next one to the next one and like domino effect that way. So that was that. That was kind of like early on my photography career. So as far as like my business model and prices and things of that sort, it wasn't really a sustainable model, So to say so fast forward to what was this 2021, 2021, late 2021, I came across this photographer. She's the coach as well. Her name was Megan the Pro. And what she's about is basically like teaching photographers how to run a sustainable photography business. And it's more sort of centered around like the luxury aspect of providing a full service to your clients. And that was something that really, like gravitated towards me. And it was this pretty much like kind of like the stars align because like, this is I couldn't I couldn't really pinpoint what it was that I was aiming for. But once I came across like her Facebook group and whatnot, I'm like, This is what I this is what I was looking for this all the time. I just kind of put in words. Yeah. So yeah, I ended up like just basically observing for like two or three months of the results that she's getting from her group. So there's like 20,000 photographers on her Facebook. Yeah. So I'm like, okay, let's, let's see how busy, like, let's see how legit this is. So I'm just hoping I was seeing like, the results. Many people are talking about two, three years to three months go by and I decide to pull the trigger on like one of her coaching courses. So with that coaching course, one of the marketing tools that was talked about was networking. So more so because it's a luxury model. So the same like it's more personal. you're really focusing on the human aspect of relationships. Building those is basically like super personal relationship building and networking is a part of that. So with that, that's how I got introduced and to try and like and be in our group. A few years ago I found out that wasn't really like my style of it just, it just wasn't my style. So I just took a pause from my in-person networking for a couple of months while I decided to like, figure some things out on my own and get comfortable with who I am as a not only as an individual, but as an entrepreneur and photographer. So just like in building, because when I realized, like there was some confidence that needed to be, that needed to be built. So I just took a couple of months of this reflecting, observing myself, just working on myself, pretty much. So I decided to come back in a few months after that was what it is, 2022, like late 2022. And that's where I had came across it. And I came in, I came across PBX. yeah, yeah, I see you. A couple of those events are. I got one tonight. I'm going to let you go into that. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I got to be there. Yeah, well, yeah, they that Christmas event last year that they had hosted at the Grand Prairie, and that was my first like, well, PDX networking event and it was hundreds of people. He has. Huge. And that was like my first time, like the stepping back into someone back in, say, the in-person networking, so to say So it was kind of overwhelming, I'll put it that way. There's so many people with so many new faces is like, that was just very overwhelming. Yeah. But I decided to like, just keep sticking it out, finding like this just, just kind of continue going to different networking events and just finding my lane and how I want to maneuver and just finding comfort. Yeah, I mean, like just finding comfort in that journey of talking to people and showing up in person right on up in general. So I definitely took a few months to get to the level of comfort that I am now with networking and things of that sort. But yes, yes, the journey is always worth it. Yeah. You mentioned about finding your lane and that level of confidence and I know exactly what you're talking about. Coincidentally also in photography that I found out that communication skills and confidence are like 100% of the business because you can't do anything without those. You're not going to find your lane and be confident in your lane unless you work on yourself. So I think everybody's in sales. I always call sales as I hate to call it sales, I call relationship building experience for relationship building skills were the first thing you got to work on is you, you know, because that's everything is you and how you get out there and talk to people. So when you say, I think you did the right thing and a lot of people don't do is a little bit of self-discovery and and the confidence level, I remember the first time I did a wedding, I photographed a wedding and my confidence level wasn't very high, but I got this job. And all these people are like looking at me. I'm on the altar. The wedding is over, right? I got pictures during the altar, but at the altar, you can imagine if you've ever been to a wedding, it's complete chaos. The groomsmen are the first time they've seen each other in years. Their party and the parents. Everybody's everywhere and nobody knows somebody needs to take charge. And I wasn't that guy that I thought to myself. That was the turning point in my career where I'm like, If I don't speak up, I'm walking out here with no pictures and we're running out of time, so what do you want to do? But my first inclination was, if I start being bossy, no one's going to like me, like, Hey, come on, guys, let's get over here. I need another groomsmen. I know the bridesmaids. I need to the friends and relatives and your uncle's and aunts and whatever grandparents. I need to get those combinations because that's what they're paying me for. So I went way outside my comfort zone and said, It's a do or die. So there's a point you made where when you want to succeed, you have to step outside that comfort level because it tells you how much you want to do something. So I knew I wanted this to work. So I'm like, Dudes, let's go. I need the guys over here. And I asked the bride, What do you want? And then I found out they weren't really listening to me. So I said, Who do you know? They can get those guys over here? They're ready to smoke cigars, ready to go drinking rager reception. How do I organize this and get the confidence to say I'm in charge? Because there's a few jobs I did when I was quiet and they completely failed. And I'm like, This isn't going to work. I'm you're going to get confidence or I'm will fail. So that pain of of failing was not something I wanted to feel, but the pain of that brief pain of being confident, being the bully for the moment pays off in the end. So you talked about staying in your lane. Do you think you've found your lane of what you like and then you're still learning That process of how to promote that lane is to looking for that. So I believe I've definitely found a I'll say, yes, I found the lane, but I know there's more like a lot more to discover within that in itself. So even with the lane of the genres of photography, I do more or Lee Lane of how I'm showing up with networking events. So in that aspect, just going off of like how I show up for networking events is more so just being more confident in who I am as an individual. So I know when I first came well, when I first stepped into like a networking scene, I was pretty much just going off of okay, just pretty much thinking what other people would think of me, like what is okay for me to wear and things of that sort. So I'm dressing like how everyone else would dress. I'm talking like how everyone else is all right, that sort. And I, I just realized like, that really is in me. So that was part of me also taking my stand back for those first couple of months. And just like finding myself and just again, just building that confidence to just show up like that's who I am. Like, I even now, like what I'm wearing now, is what I would wear to a networking event I might have when I first started networking. You'll probably just see me like in a foursome or something of that sort. But now I am more like now if we're into it, just who I am as an individual. I'm just not necessarily just being myself and I like everyone else. So yeah, it's hard to believe that people have to work on being themselves. And just because the world's waiting to see who you are and if you're just like your body because you're afraid to stand out, no one's ever discover how unique you are and people hide that. It's a shame. So I'm glad to hear that, that when you show up, I'm seeing you and not who you want me to see and those things. And I think that consistency in that is very helpful in networking. So that's a good observation. And even to go off of that, a lot of people I realized a lot of people when they step out into the world, they wear masks. So understanding like the society that we live in, people feel like they have to wear a mask and things of that sort, especially within the business realm and business as a professional, things of that nature. So my approach to doing my business is like I'm holding that space for people to take off their mask and just breathe like it's okay to breathe. So in your in your business for your clients, you're allowing them to and also for networking the people around you. Yeah, that's great. Yeah. So that's just me as and when people would say be themselves because I know how it feels to have to have on that. All right. Right. This is suffocating. So it's just like whatever. Like if I'm talking to a stranger out in the street or something, a random person or a networking event, or if I'm working with my makeup artist or like with a class. So to see and more specifically with a client, just letting them take that mask off helps tremendously with capturing who they are as an individual. So that essence of who they are because they're not like this is just this is denim and Ralph Lauren, like this isn't a facade that they're putting on. All right. So in roles or images that society claims, you have to make, society make people feel you have to play to. Yeah. And like I said, just know. I just know how it feels to have that mask on and when you have that mask off, it just feels so freeing. So how do you I know as a as I start to get into, one of the first things I did was portrait photography, tried to environmental portrait photography. I found that I didn't like it because of what you said I want. I like candid, I like real smiles. I don't want to tell someone to smile. So I found myself doing a learning a lot of psychology. Like you get to read somebody, find out where they are, and then find a way to relax them. How do you how do you go about how do you tackle that now? You thought you were a photographer studying photography business. And I realize there's this huge aspect of psychology involved in this and making someone feel comfortable around you. How do you break that ice? I was telling a friend not too long ago I was talking, so I'm like, it's like I'm a photographer, but I'm also a therapist, right? Exactly. Like a bartender in a sense. Yeah. You want someone to relax around you, but you got to figure them out and figure out how to do that. And so photography in itself is a very vulnerable activity. So to say like, this is very vulnerable. Standing in front of the camera and allowing the photographer to capture who you are as an individual. So in that aspect is very important to have someone behind the camera that knows what they're doing. That way, if you can, that adds up to you being able to relax a little more in front of the camera, speaking as if I were the client and that's the company and that's the plan to relax a little more in front of the camera where they can trust who is behind the camera taking those photos at them. Now to take it a step further and just to, like, touch on like my process of how I go about doing like this, just letting clients feel relax and feel comfortable. So I have a consultation. Like after we do that discovery, which we can talk about, but the consultation, which is a very important part of the process I'm working with like camisole photography and with the consultation is that's basically where I go to the client in person. We create a vision board for what we're looking to accomplish for our session. We find out with our vision where we finalize their poses, expressions, as well as our wardrobe. So in the wardrobe aspect, we're picking out their clothing together so that way they don't feel like they're in it on their own. A lot of people want advice on clothing. They're always that What do you wear? What colors are good? Because you know, and you're helping them with those decisions. They don't know. They know what they like to wear. But what looks good on camera and what do you like to wear? Yeah. And with the vision board, it helps everyone to see like we're putting things. It's not paper, but it's kind of like we're putting things down on paper so we know exactly what it is We're looking to make a plan. You got to have a plan. Yeah. Everyone knows. Like I said, important part. The most important thing about the consultation is that everyone is on the same page as far as communicating exactly what it is we're looking to accomplish with our system. So with that, that pretty much builds that foundation. What we're working off of and like I said to some person, so I'm building rapport with these people in person already before we even take the photos. So at that they already get a sense of who I am. I get a sense of who they are. If we're doing like family photos or some sort, I get to meet the children and things of that nature. So they're already familiar like, All right, a like by the time we take it, we're taking our photos. The children already know, like his daughter. He's back. Yeah. So that communication is so important. And to recognize that is the difference between being successful and not being successful. It's recognizing that there's more to this than just showing up and taking a picture. It's not a transaction. A lot of people will hire a photographer for a transaction, and once they realize that there's more going on than just a consultation, there's a getting to know you process, a familiarity process, a relaxing process that you're really getting them ready for the session. And then the kids are when you when they see you again, it's not a big my gosh, who is this guy? They know who you are now. Now you stay in that in that niche and that can be claustrophobic for some photographers because I do weddings, I do port decided I do everything. But you are staying in specializing is something you love to do and how do you how do you what types of clients do you look for and how do you know during this communication process if you're with the right person? Yeah. So like pretty much like at the root of it all, I just the class I look for or the people who not only value their self-image, value themselves and this like you can see you can get you can get an idea of that just by looking at someone. So I was telling someone not so long ago as well, like stories where we where it tells a story. So and it just off of that one outfit. Many stories can be told, but you can tell if someone really cares to a degree. You can tell if someone really cares, how much someone cares about themselves, about how they met, like how they show up in public, how they carry themselves, their demeanor and things of that sort. So if we're like at a networking event or things of that nature, like this is pretty much like how I'm reading people and it's like and it may not be the greatest way to go about it, but this is one of those metrics that I use in a sense. So just pretty much like how the person carries themself, that gives me an idea of, okay, this may be someone I want to go talk to, not necessarily pitch to, but yeah, individual. You're basically you're, you're prospecting in a way. You're kind of looking for the person that's that's a good fit for you or if they know someone who's a good fit for you. I know that I always talk about sales communications, that they're really good skills to have. And and the toughest thing to do in sales is to cold call. But there are people and I like to use the analogy of fishing, if you know the right bait in the right area, you know, when they're biting and you know the fish, you kind of you'll catch more than if you just like throwing that out there, you know, the way you're going to get So you know how to look at people. So when you let's get back to your your your actual procedure, what makes you unique and I think I saw something you posted on LinkedIn I thought was fascinating. I think I mentioned it to you. It was the entire process of things that I wish I could have done as a photographer would have wanted to do, but didn't think people had the patience for it. Or maybe I thought it was like taking it too far. But it's actually good that you go as far as looking at a place to hang that picture, to decide what picture to take for that space in that house. Tell me about that process. Yeah. So that's also another thing that's part of the consultation as well. So after we're done creating their vision board, I mean, as a client, are there any rooms in your home that you would like to place wall art or things of that sort? So they say, Yeah, then we'll shop around like their house to see you and just point out some areas like there maybe like an empty space in their living room and or there is like on their staircase seeing like the wall going up the staircase. They may have like thinking of a collage of images going up the wall or like a bedroom fireplace image over the fireplace or something of that sort,. So sometimes there is there's there are there are walls where there's already images up on the wall and they're they're just like, I want to replace this image with another image. Or I may suggest like we could place that image right here or over here. So in a sense, so there's photography, there's a therapist and then there's interior design. So that's where the interior design has. It comes into play with just styling the clients with art of not necessarily just random art, but this is art of them or of that they value. Art their family themselves, their spouse. So emphasize putting out your images and. Yeah, I know what you brought when you when you when you talk at these network meetings, you're actually bringing prints and your cards are very that one of your statements was get them out there. Don't keep on your phone, put them somewhere, you know, And even then some people will will take the pictures that portrait photographers take and they stay digital and they go on social media. And that's really all they do with them. They're not in a book. They don't make photo albums aren't big anymore, but you're emphasizing tangible things in your hand. Going off of that. A lot of people, they're then going back to like a transaction that you have made with people, some clients and some photographers, like just the example that I had given that day was like, people have over a thousand images on their on their phones. How often do you go back and write images and then take it a step further? You pay for a professional photo shoot and you're just worried about the images, or you just have the images of that session. How many times do you go back and look at those images as compared to like printing out these images? These are images that you're seeing every day. You're walking past every day. They remind you of how much whatever it is that you value that's in that image, you're being reminded of that. So a lot of people get self esteem, boosts, confidence boosts and just it just takes them back to that special moment, reminds them of what they truly love and value. Because if you have if you have this piece of art on your wall, then you must evaluate like there has to be some extreme amount of value. And that's not not talking about the like random pieces of art and things of that sort of like just going back to like I of having random pieces of art have something more meaningful. So pieces of art like yourself, family, couples or spouse, things of that nature, things of that nature, you're just being reminded constantly. You're seeing these in your home if you have them only. I know some clients, they have like a office desk print that they may use when they are prints at their office. So you're seeing these images, whether you're at home or at work, you're reminded, constantly reminded as compared to from like. You never going to open your phone to see those images. You're not going to be reminded of your family. Out of sight. Exactly. Yes. In your phone. Yeah. And I think that's good. I also heard some things about what that does to a child's confidence when they see a picture of them with a family and it kind of tells you where you belong. And it's reminding every day of that you belong. It's not like in your phone, like, here you can't remind someone of that if they don't see it. When they come home every day and they see a family and they see, you know, themselves like you're valued so much, there's a picture of you right there. And there's there's there's something to be said about that. So how do you go about on your daily work? And there's a whole bunch of stuff that you can do to get the word out there about what you do. Obviously, networking is one of them. Cold calling is one. You're using social media now. Not to date myself, there was no social media when I started photography. You had to develop film and no one saw it but me. You know what a great powerful tool that can be. How are you leveraging that on a professional level, like with LinkedIn type stuff in on a a more consumer to consumer type of level? Yeah. So professional level with LinkedIn. So a lot of people have they come to me, a lot of my class come to me for professional headshots. So LinkedIn is a social media for professionals, So all right, we're just hand in hand. So I was like, Why not? Why wouldn't be on this platform? This is where this is where my clientele like this is where I would find my clients. Like if you want to based if you want to be strategic when operating your business and this is a no brainer. You're right. Yeah I'm so this showcasing and I do this on both Instagram and Facebook, on Instagram and Facebook as well as LinkedIn. So just showcasing the experience. So I'm able to like with Rails and things of that sort because there are pushing social media is pushing videos very heavily over the past two years or so. Yeah, and just taking advantage of the video format of showing what the experience looks like when like someone behind the scenes or when clients are picking out their images, when clients or some say saw them behind the scenes of how I get a certain image. And then so in the final product of what that image looks like. So they're seeing it behind the scenes and this is how it came out. So there's that. I'm just able to show people this is what it looks like to work with less camera. So photography, this is what you can expect when working with like cameras on photography, but just going back to the LinkedIn aspect, it's more so like just pretty much honing in on that professional side of the business. So I sometimes post and like posture work as far as family photos, like beauty portraits, things of that sort. But I know with LinkedIn a lot of people are more focused on their professional side. So the profile picture that they're using, the professional side, so does that. Yeah, it does. It does. You got to you got to treat the format for what it's worth. Like there's social media, there's there's a thing for Instagram as well. There's so many different platforms because each do something unique. You may not be a TikTok type of person or a profession because you don't communicate while there, but you may be an Instagram because it's more image based or maybe Twitter because it's informational based or something. So when you how do you handle something I think is curious and something I had problems with as a photographer, Some one photographer too. Another when you're doing a portrait or headshot for somebody or professional shot and they're constantly criticized the way they look, they're down on themselves. Can you make my nose smaller, my lips, my chin? Can you can you make me look thinner or got acne or something? And they really want to look like somebody they don't look like. And you're almost like a therapist in a sense. Like, listen, I use you're you're not going to be Miss America, okay? I can't. But I want to I want you to be comfortable being who you are. But a lot of people aren't. They want to look different. They don't realize that every day their face is out there. Everybody's seeing it. But for some reason, the photographs have to look so much better. You should look your best, but not like somebody you're not. How do you walk someone through that process? Yeah. So I don't know. With a lot of with clients that are more like and bigger in size, so to say their way of like not looking flattering on the image and the image, I say. So my remedy with that is just like is just working with the angles and how to pose them. And that's where there are some clients. And so just going back to like working with the angles for a more flattering image, I would take the photos like pose them in the photo and then pose them in the pose and then take the photo. And that showed on the back of the camera. It's like, so I'm like, okay, and how is it how is this like this? This works out? Is this what we're looking for? Things that that's or so it's pretty much like just trial and error in a sense. Yeah. Let down because not every client has the same one thing doesn't work for every client. That's just my way of is just try and find in what works for them, what angles work for them, what poses work for them. Sometimes I ask clients like, okay, what's your preferred side of your face? Yeah, that helps a lot. Now, with the acne aspect, that's no problem at all. Because if first yeah, that's temporary, you can just get rid of that. Yeah. Yeah. But for like change, a change in someone's nose and things of that sort. I can't do that. Yeah. No, it's almost I get to tell them I hate to be the one to tell them. You need to be confident. I don't like the fact that I'm bald, but it's going to be in every picture, I think. You know, or high cheekbones or my eyes are so recessed or shadow. That's how I look. I'm just. You just have to be comfortable with it. Just how you are. And I don't have to, like, love the picture, but it is me. And that's that's I think is important. Right? And so it stems a lot from comparison. A lot of people are comparing themselves to whatever right. Where they're on social media. All the filters and stuff they get. Yeah, yeah. So I'm not sure how it was like back then, but I know social media and movies just the. It was the same. It was like magazines at that point you saw glamor magazines and everyone who had read the Glamor magazine was going to be a problem because they're watching how they think the other half lives. I mean, it's been around since magazines and photographs are around. There's someone looking better and there's always this I want to be better than them or I want to look like them or there's a or, you know, movie stars think maybe movies started that thing. Yeah. And then being content in who you are as an individual. Yeah. Some people you can never satisfy. You just have to, you know, be that way. So when you as a photographer, you're an artist. Yeah. And then but you're also a business person and you have to make money. So you have to find an art that can pay your bills because the mortgage isn't free. So how do you balance your your the artistic aspect of it and still maintain the technical, the finances, you know, the equipment you buy, the studio you're going to have the lights and all that stuff and how you market yourself and getting enough business so you can maintain your art and do it the way you do. Is there a strategy you have or a methods, how much time you put into each? Yeah. So I'll say when I first started off photography, I started off just taking photos of like landscapes going downtown, taking pictures of buildings, cityscapes of nature and things of that sort. And with these photos, I would add, like a story of how I'm feeling in that, yeah, I'm going to like this is how I'm expressing, depending on like so that's okay. One photo that comes to mind I had taken of the incline, so I had taken that photo, blacked out. Everything is set for the drawing. So that probably was in color. Like everything else was black and white. And the story behind that was this was like the light at the end of the tunnel. So I can't recall specifically what it was I was going through at that time, but it was kind of like that period of hope and faith and didn't like, is this just that? But with that, I couldn't really find a way to make money off. You had to monetize that. Yeah. Yeah. So I had to graduate into working with people. Now that was a journey of its own because I was more I was very sad and very introverted. So that you talk about seminars, your comfort zone. Yeah, it was very much out of my comfort zone. Just having to make that pivot and pivoting as a light is a thing that you have to do a lot in business as well is what I had learned. But pivoting to working with people and I kind of like transitioned my mentality from instead of making art for myself is making my clients happy with the art that I'm creating for them. However, that may work, just know that I'm doing my best to create. Yeah, what they're looking for. And as long as they're satisfied, I'm satisfied. Now I have I'll say with doing that I kind of lost touch with the original aspect of how I was expressing myself. All right. Yeah, that happens. I mean, when you're told as a kindergartner what you want to be when you grow up, that's going to change. A few times. You start to photography business is going to change for your taste. I wanted to be a photographer. Now I'm a video producer. I tried to get into law school. I mean, you're looking for something that you like and you end up doing what you feel like you want to do, but then you have to compromise at some point because something pays the bills or something. And there are some things I did for a long time I didn't like doing. I did it because it paid the bills and it's always good to do things that you may not like because you weren't comfortable. Jobs that where I'm working outside or in. I don't like that environment or I'm in the heat all day long. But I got to do that because I need to pay the bills or I'm doing the side job for things that related to what I do. But they're difficult. But it's about, you know, the economy. You got it. You got to make money doing it. So you want to hone your skills to be to do what you enjoy doing and find a way. You're always looking for a way to improve that. Where do you see yourself, say, five years from now? How do you see your business? It may change like in everyone changes as they go, but the way you're thinking right now, where do you see Jordan Jenkins is in like ten years. Man. So ten years, I would say many different franchises of my business and wherever, like whether it's in Pittsburgh, whatever it be, one in Pittsburgh, just different places around the U.S. So franchises, I see myself owning like a a building. So I have well, as clear as that 2020, I believe I had went down to Atlanta for a coaching seminar and where they had posted if it was for photography. So where they had posted the photography coaching seminar was in some warehouse. But this warehouse had like all like all the rooms were creative studios. And I'm like, This is dope. Yeah, this is where I like this. Creative is being able to come in and just express their creativity. However that may some different rooms and different backgrounds, different sets and things of that sort. And just understanding that and just knowing and understanding that every area has a place of that sort where they gave the opportunity for artists to come in and just express themselves with that type of available spaces. So there's that. And I also see myself having a videographer. Yeah, a lot of you, a lot of people have been asking me if I do radiography over the years and I'm like, No, yeah. Photography. The more people ask me, the more I've been like, Maybe this is right. So the cameras do both, so it's easier to experiment a little bit. Like, what do you need me to do? Because I know when I moved from photography to video, it's a money pit. Yeah, it is. It's. I remember being on jobs where I took the video side of it and being the photographer, like in a wedding, I'm thinking, Man, all that wedding photographer has to do is in that reader goes up to read, click, they're done. I've got to get the audio. I have to have it uncut from beginning to end. You got to hear it, see it. All this stuff for for the duration. I'll click go I, I wish I was due to click go. I can't click and go, you know so there's sometimes I wish I could just click and go. But video is is like the other dimension of time and in the technical quality of lighting and then audio comes into play. Lighting component comes into play, but it's composition over time and then you need editing. It's like, I guess it's it's a whole different animal than photography. So it's something if you're photographer, I'd encourage you to get into, but it's do the small stuff and then work Q&A because it just get then you get multi-camera stuff. It just gets it can get out of hand because every kind of like of every kind of lighting you get. Yeah, but what kind of video do you see yourself doing? If you could do the kind of video you like to do, what would you see? So it's more it would be more so like interview style. So just going back to my approach with how I do like how I bring my sessions with clients and making them feel comfortable is giving them a voice. So a lot of people, like with the mask, when you step outside, you have a mask on and and with that I'm in front of video aspect is just giving people a voice. Like similar to what we're doing here is it's having people share their story, sharing your story. You know, whatever it is that you're saying can help whoever it is. All right. And, so stories are meant to be told as well as listen to. Yeah. And I think now in one of my commercials, it you probably heard this but video now as opposed to 510 years ago is so deliverable now you can deliver it and you can consume it easily. That's why we don't have to order DVDs and have them shipped to us to watch a movie. It's streaming 24 seven. You can watch video anywhere. So it's a great form of communication and it's out there and I think you need to leverage that kind of communication because it's the next best thing to being there. If it wasn't so deliverable, you probably wouldn't to use it before. It was like I remember back early 2000 when when I had to show a client something and I said, Well, are you on Windows or Mac? And I had a some W and V file, and then they said, I can't watch it, it's too big a file, I can't download it. I'm like, my gosh. So I'd lower and lower the data rates so they could see it all. It looks horrible, the quality of them. Like, listen, I mean, it's just so many different codecs. There were so many different recipes. And when they came out with age to 64, I'm like, my gosh, thank you. They got one. I can use that for a commercial on television now. It can be in your PowerPoint, it can be on Vimeo, it can be on YouTube. One file is 264. The MPEG four is universal. It can work on a mac, it work on a PC, it can work anywhere. So that was a difficult bridge to get. But I think outside of that, I'm glad that at least video became somewhat easier to deliver. So now it should be used on a regular basis to communicate, I think. Yeah, Videographers definitely. It's a different type of blow. Who is like you saying this instead of still photos? This is time in motion and it's it's just beautiful to see like how that's captured and just what that represents for whatever specific moment of time that is, whether it's a wedding or a corporate interview or how things like this is is this is beautiful. Yeah, I think what I was getting at, I think when I say that because it's so easy to do and is so easy to deliver and consume that the reason one of the reasons I'm doing this podcast is because I think now because of YouTube, I don't think YouTube is going anywhere. I don't think ever. So I think it's basically archiving everything. So why not archive wisdom through stories so that it's possible now, now that my great great grandchildren can see me talk and share advice that was never possible before. I know who my great great grandfather is, but now it can be. That link is right there, you know, forever. People can document this wisdom and now share it. And not only just everybody's wisdom, but that's my great grandfather. You know, my great great grandfather had a podcast and is he's sharing wisdom, but maybe they want to get in the same business I'm in or it's different now. They want to hear about it, but that is possible now. Those stories can be told, and I wish everybody would do that because YouTube is going to keep making servers and they're going to keep taking billions and billions of video videos out there and storing them and making it redundant so that anyone can tell story and keep it out there. So how can I how can I get a hold of you? How do people get hold of you? We're going to post links on how to get in touch with you, but how if someone wants to work with you after hearing your method, how do they get a hold of you? Is there their website? Yeah. So you can find me on my web site. W w w that live camera. So photography dot net. I'm not sold on social I'm not sold on social media, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter and LinkedIn under Life, Camisole Photography. And those are two places you can find me at. I appreciate you taking the time and coming out here and sharing your story. It's always good to hear that there was a one point where you're vulnerable and you're questioning your confidence and I don't think a lot of people who are who want to be entrepreneurs know that the people who just you don't just start overnight is not a preneur. There's a lot of soul searching. I appreciate you sharing that with me because it touched lot and a lot of what I had to go through. And you're going through the same thing and I think you're on the right track. I'm looking forward to see the kind of stuff you do. I love seeing your work and hope people call you. So thanks for being on here, Jordan. If I can. Sure get. Like one major thing that I realize would be an entrepreneur is there. So an a personal aspect of life intertwines heavily with the life of being an entrepreneur. Like they work hand in hand. Yeah. So for whatever it is and I think you touched on this earlier with you have to work on yourself to get the results that you want with whatever aspect that may be through entrepreneurship, but it starts with you. So you have to be open to believing that you can improve, you should improve yourself. But there are some people who say I'm fine and they don't see it, but Just be open to the fact that maybe if something's not working, like When I first started my business and I left my job, there was a guy that wanted to work with me. We were going to buy a business together like this $2 million business. He's like, I need a partner. I think you're the guy. This is a video related business. Let's do this together. And he asked me a question because I just left my my job at Channel four. He goes, How do you know you're not going back? I'm not going back. Even people who were there said, you'll be back, You'll be back. You can't just quit your job and become a freelance editor. You can't just do that because I left my job without a job. And they thought, You're lying. And I gave him a two weeks notice are like, Where are you going? I'm like, No, I'm going to quit. Like, you're trying to negotiate something. And then I left, and then this guy asked me, he says, How do you know your business is successful? I go, Because I'm making money. Because what if it fails? I go, What do you mean fail? Because my mind was, I don't know what failure is. I'm like, he's like, Well, what if what if you stop getting clients? I'm like, I'll find your clients. I said. He goes, But what if it fails? I go, You keep asking me that. What if it fails? I'm like, Here's the problem with what if it fails? Here's my thinking right now. If if I can't make it videography, nobody can. That was in my mind. Like, if there's a dude over there making money with videos, he's doing something right. I'm doing something wrong. I need to look at what I'm doing and admit something's wrong because it's still being done. Now, if you told me no one in the world can make money off video, the last videographer went out of business. I'm probably not going to look at that, but as long as I see somebody doing it, it can be done. I just got to change the way I'm doing it. So there's no failure. There's quitting just to the point where you're like, I don't want to change myself. I'm just going to quit because other people, I'll let them do it. Like if I want to be a real estate agent, what if you fail? It's still being done. So if I failed me quitting, that's how I start. So that was my entrepreneur epiphany when I told this guy that and I actually said it out loud because I'm like failures when you just quit trying it. Because if there's someone doing it, you can do it. Yeah. Great advice. Be open to working on yourself. Even go off it. That is like the way I approach it is failure is not an option. I don't have any other choice. Right, right, right. Yeah. I have. Like, I have to figure it out. Whatever it is, I will figure it out to like there is no other. I don't have any other option. I don't see any other option. I don't want to say. All right, so we're going to figure this out, right? The pain of failure is horrible. So the pain of success is just not as bad is pain, but it's not as bad. But for me, the pain is if I have to get a job, I would do whatever it takes to not have to work a job. I will reinvent myself. I don't care what it takes. I want to find out what are you doing? I got to do because I'm not going back to work. I can't. I can imagine it. But yeah, exactly. I appreciate you taking the time and being very kind of me today. Jordan, Good luck and everything you do. I'll see you around at the chamber, but. All right,